For those readers of Navel Gazing, the updating on our lawsuit against Art Pedroza and the Orange Juice Blog didn’t tell the complete story. The case reaches critical mass at 5PM this afternoon, where we’ve asked Art to accept our final settlement offer to resolve our lawsuit. Art has rejected it last night and in turn submitted a counter offer significantly lower than one he offered a few days ago. He’s given us a 5PM deadline today to accept his terms. He also sent the email string to OC Weekly where Gustavo Arellano put a post up right away without making a single call to any of us.
The late Radio commenter Paul Harvey had a feature called “The Rest of the Story.” And if Gustavo had called, he’d have it.
So, in a few nutshells, here’s what Art and Gustavo didn’t tell you.
- In a settlement meeting with our lawyer last week, Art agreed to write an apology for his actions in prompting the lawsuit. He wrote me last week asking for “guidance” on crafting the apology. I did not offer any.
- Art then asked us to write his apology for him, which he’d review and put his name to it. This option was completely unacceptable to us. We’re actually offended that he doesn’t seem to understand what he did was unlawful, illegal, and offensive and needs us to remind him of what to apologize for.
- Art offered up a self-imposed ban on his political blogging in OC for a period of five years. No one is interested in infringing on Art’s First Amendment right to make a fool of himself, misreport news, change comments on his blog, delete comments that are critical of him or Sean Mill, or defame and libel others on his blog. Besides, even if Art’s byline no longer appears on posts, I’m sure “Zorro” would post plenty.
- Art offered to give us the Orange Juice blog — lock, stock and barrel — as part of the settlement; we didn’t ask for it. But as the blog is an asset, we did an independent web site valuation using tools that do this sort of thing and stats Art gave us on ad revenue and we valued the OJ blog at $5,000 which Art agreed was an accurate cash value assessment. But he withdrew the offer citing the “political value” of the blog as much higher. It is impossible to gauge the political value of a blog. For example, my wife’s engagement ring has incalculable sentimental value to us. But it has a distinct cash value. The same thing holds true for the cash value of the OJ blog. Oh, and for Sean, Vern, Gabriel and the rest of the OJ blog team, Art asked us not to say anything while he threw you all under the bus. And we didn’t. Until now. Have fun explaining this one Art.
- What’s missing in all this is Art didn’t turn over a single document asked of him in discovery and this included a copy of his hard drive. He told us he didn’t have the time to do this (but has plenty of time to blog and run for SAUSD) and challenged us to get a court order if we wanted those documents. We did. Our motion to compel Art to provide discovery documents was granted and the federal judge gave Art two weeks to produce all the records we requested and ordered him to pay $2,500 in sanctions. The deadline came and went and Art did nothing. He defied a federal court order. But we do wonder who he is protecting by not turning over the hard drive (and perhaps those people should start writing checks to help Art settle).
- Sean Mill wrote a post in May where he listed several of my clients and linked to their websites. He defended Art’s redirects of www.MadisonAlexanderPublicRelations.com to NAMBLA as “political free speech” on the part of Art Pedroza. And two of those clients have since gone away and the combined revenue is $11,000 a month. That post has since been scrubbed. That’s all I’m going to say about that due to NDAs with said clients.
All along, a pattern has emerged when dealing with Art. We get a passive, apologetic person seeking to resolve this dispute, which then escalates to unacceptable demands from him, and further evolves into suggestions we do things to ourselves that are anatomically impossible. As we went through this last series of emails, every one of us saw this pattern coming again. But hey, don’t take my word for it. Here are Art’s emails below.
From: Art Pedroza [mailto:artpedroza@gmail.com]
Sent: Tuesday, August 17, 2010 5:00 PM
To: Dan Chmielewski
Subject: Re: RE: the photo
Meeting with Todd felt productive. Discussed settlement terms.
Have thought further about it and want to extend another offer.
How about I firm over the Orange Juice to you? It surely is a valuable property.
Ponder that and let me know. I would also agree to ban myself from OC blogging, although I would like to keep my Santa Ana blog going.
Thanks,
Art
From: apedroza [mailto:apedroza@earthlink.net]
Sent: Tuesday, August 17, 2010 5:52 PM
To: ‘Todd Gallinger’
Cc: ‘Dan Chmielewski’; ‘Christopher Leah Prevatt’; ‘Claudio Gallegos’
Subject: RE: Thinking Liberally Media Inc., v. Art Pedroza, et al
Mr. Gallinger,
Thanks for meeting with me today.Â
I have thought further about my offer and would like to make an alternate offer as I know you weren’t too pleased with the terms we discussed.
Under this scenario I would turn over my Orange Juice blog to your clients, lock, stock and barrel. Â And I would agree to ban myself form OC political blogging, say for a five year term.
However, I would like to keep my Santa Ana blog going.
The Orange Juice blog is a valuable property. It is one of the highest ranking blogs in California, and it generates a few hundred dollars worth of ad revenue per month. Your clients would own it all, including our library and the two URLs that point to it, www.theorangejuice.com and www.orangejuiceblog.com. I have been offered a lot of money for both those URLs by people in the orange juice beverage industry.
The only things I ask in return are:
- Dropping the lawsuit
- Deleting all references to Nambla and myself, and my financials, from your client’s blog
- Giving me back my URL and giving Sean Mill his URL.
Let me know if this is acceptable. If so I would ask you to draw up the agreement and when your clients sign off I will turn over the blog, no questions asked.
I realize this might seem abrupt and shocking, but I want my life back. I am not the evil person I have been made out to be. Like all humans I have my good and bad side. I am imperfect. I erred and as such I am willing to pay a price, although I still feel that did not start this mess. That aside, I intend to see it concluded.
If your clients find this acceptable they may do what they want with our current editorial staff and post library. I have no agreements with any of my writers. They write for me at will and are not compensated.
We do have some paid ads in place for Phu Nguyen and the CAPO recall that I would ask you to continue. All other ads may be deleted. The revenue for the Nguyen and CAPO ads went to Vern Nelson. I would ask that he be allowed to keep it as he really needs the money.
This is not a trick. I am offering this proposal in full sincerity. I have not discussed it with anyone else, nor do I intend to. I ask only that you and your clients likewise keep this confidential until we can come to an agreement.
Thank you,
Art Pedroza
Publisher
Orange Juice Blog
From: apedroza [mailto:apedroza@earthlink.net]
Sent: Tuesday, August 17, 2010 10:49 PM
To: ‘Dan Chmielewski’
Subject: RE: Thinking Liberally Media Inc., v. Art Pedroza, et al
I texted Claudio earlier to advise this (a post from Sean Mill attacking Claudio, ed note) was coming. You can ask him if you don’t believe me.
I don’t want Sean or anyone else to figure out what I am up to with regard to the settlement.  Please be patient. I am not going to cross post this on my Santa Ana blog. Once we conclude our arrangement you can delete this post and others you find offensive.
You and the other Plaintiffs, and Todd, are the only ones who know about my offer to settle, besides my wife and she is keeping mum about it.
I hope you understand the fix I am in relative to trying to control Sean. Hopefully we can conclude our business soon so this sort of thing can end once and for all.
Thanks,
Art Pedroza
Publisher
Orange Juice Blog
From: apedroza@earthlink.net [mailto:apedroza@earthlink.net]
Sent: Wednesday, August 18, 2010 3:28 PM
To: Dan Chmielewski
Subject: Re: Thinking Liberally Media Inc., v. Art Pedroza, et al
I want to start working on my sorry post. Â Do you have any parameters I should follow?
Thanks,
Art
sent from my AT&T Smartphone by HTC
From: apedroza [mailto:apedroza@earthlink.net]
Sent: Sunday, August 22, 2010 8:38 AM
To: ‘Todd Gallinger’
Cc: ‘Dan Chmielewski’; ‘Christopher Leah Prevatt’; ‘Claudio Gallegos’
Subject: RE: Settlement Counter Offer
Importance: High
Mr. Gallinger,
Please disregard my previous email. I have had sufficient time to ponder your counter-offer and am offering a counter-offer to your counter-offer herein.
I can appreciate that your clients do not want to waste any more of their time or money on this case. I too would like to settle this as quickly as possible so that we may all move forward unencumbered by this matter.
I agree not to allow any posts or comments regarding this matter. Please note that I can only control what happens on my own blogs.Â
I also propose that the terms of this settlement be held in strict confidence by all parties to this lawsuit, with the notable exception of the apology your clients want me to write and post. Â If any of the parties to this agreement release the terms of this settlement it will be nullified in favor of the or other party.
With regards to the written apology, I need to know what your clients want me to say. Either provide me with a template, or the parameters, of said apology. Or have your clients write it and if I agree to it I will post it as is under my name. Once I review that I will be able to make a decision as to whether or not to agree to that.  I don’t foresee a problem with this, but again I must know what this apology is to entail before I agree to it.
With regard to the URL www.artpedroza.com, I can understand your sentiment. I propose then to buy it from your client, for a price not to exceed what he paid for it, or $100, whichever amounts is greater.  If he paid more for it than $100 I will need to see some proof of payment, such as a canceled check.  Let me be clear, any settlement that does NOT include my acquisition of this URL will be of no interest to me, period.
Furthermore, I must insist that any settlement include the deletion of any posts or comments at the Liberal OC blog that refer to me promoting NAMBLA. That is an untruth and you and your clients know it. In return for this I will offer once more to delete ANY comments or posts on either of my blogs that your clients would like me to delete, no questions asked.  Please submit a list of such posts and comments and I will delete them if I have not already done so. I ask also that any posts that refer to my financials be likewise deleted. Again, I must insist on this. If you or your clients are unwilling to accept this then we will not have a settlement.
Let me add that post-settlement I will NOT allow of my writers, as part of this settlement, to refer to any of your clients, or you, by name.
As for the amount of the settlement, $25,000 seems excessive. I am willing to pay $17,500. That will be all-inclusive and includes the amount I am supposed to pay for not responding to discovery in a timely manner.
As you know, I cannot, right now, pay this at the monthly amount you suggested. Instead I am offering the following payment schedule:
(this table of a payment plan would not cut and paste..sorry, ed note)
Payments will commence on Jan. 2, 2011. This will give me time to start and develop a settlement account. Payments thereafter will be on the first of each successive month, to your office, as you outlined.
I appreciate your offer for my blogs. It is an accurate reflection of their cash value, but your offer does not include the political value of these blogs, which is substantial. As such I will not include my blogs in this settlement.
Please advise if these terms are acceptable, or please feel free to offer a counter-offer.
Very truly yours,
Art Pedroza
Publisher
Orange Juice Blog
******
Since Art’s offer didn’t cover the accrued legal fees in the case, we asked for the final settlement in the amount if $25,000 which covered the legal fees. Our lawyer suggested we lower our expectations a bit to settle, and we agreed to take a small loss in exchange for the settlement. Art rejected the offer last night and sent the email to OC Weekly.Â
In regards to our contention that Art promoted NAMBLA on websites he owned as “an untruth and you and your clients know it,” I’ll remind folks Art boasted on where the redirects to the URLs he acquired pointed to in an OJ post now since scrubbed. And in an email to us dated November 23, 2009, Art wrote: “I think you will definitely appreciate where madisonalexanderpublicrelations.com is fowarding to! Let’s just say it will really hit home for you…..” And Art copied Chris Prevatt, Claudio Gallegos, Ryan Trabuco, Sean Mill and “Red Vixen” on his email. That post has since been scrubbed but we still have the email and both do constitute the viral promotion of NAMBLA by Art. This action was described as a joke. It was willful, malicious and when we asked him to remove the redirect, he told us no. It wasn’t changed until our post in November that outed his behavior. Abd it certainly can’t help him as he runs for school board in Santa Ana.
Since Art defied a federal court order and in previous communications, admitted to the material facts in the case, and we have a mountain of evidence against him already, we are likely to move ahead with a default judgment against him.Â
His defiant refusal to settle on our terms is a desperate act of a drowning man. If he really cares about his family, he’ll agree to our terms. He has until 5PM today.
In regards to Art’s 5PM deadline, sorry. We’re not biting. What is his recourse if we don’t? Is he going to hold his breath until he turns blue? There’s another deadline that actually happens tomorrow; that’s when Art’s foreclosed home is supposed to be sold at auction at noon at the County Courthouse. As of last week, he was attempting to get a loan modification. If this lawsuit is any indication, the eviction process will take months.
Even the awarding of a single dollar in damages in this lawsuit is a victory for us and allows us to collect our legal fees from him which is really all we’re after. But without the lawsuit, he’d still own the URLs in question and he’d still be trying to damage our reputations on the Internet. And we plan to. And we will.
All of this is…..BOOOOOORING!!!!!!!! Get back to covering real issues instead of your Jr. High pissing matches. I’ve seen better writing in “Grit.”
pedroza is such a wussy. personally i would have told you guys to go f yourselves.
You guys took this way too far, if you have huge legal bills that is of your own making. Destroying a man financially and putting his family at risk is waaaay UNCOOL!
not a single dollar has passed between Art and us. Art’s financial troubles are of his own making. I have nothing to do with Art failing to pay his mortgage or running up big credit card bills. If you want to point of finger of blame of the man who is destroyed financially and putting his family at risk, you need to look to Art.
Oh please, your lawsuit (as ALL lawsuits do) has created tremendous stress and distraction for Art at a time when he was already struggling financially.
There is a special place in hell reserved for those who feel the need to kick someone when they are already down.
He had no trouble buying about $300 in URLs six weeks before Christmas.
He had no trouble redirecting web sites he owned that referenced his political enemies to gay porn and NAMBLA.
He’s had no trouble posting financial records and divorce records of his political enemies online.
He could have resolved all of this cheaply and easily last November and in January when sent the cease and desist.
By all means, if you want to help Art, write him a check.
Why so VINDICTIVE Dan?
So your web site was directed to porn, big effin’ deal, a better man would have shrugged it off or at the very least NOT have continued to pursue this with lawyers.
Yeah, you’ve won, but at what cost to YOUR reputation?
Ditto all three of these comments. What a pathetic boring spectacle.
Anon and Vern
How convenient of you to forget this is a mess entirely of Art’s own making. He though it so fun, empowering, and entertaining, to level countless attacks on everyone that didn’t agree with him. Everyone knows now that the truth was never that important to Art, and he would just switch gears and attack from a different direction when caught in these lies.
What a sick bugger he is, sitting in front of his computer, puking his poison, endlessly while his family life fell apart.
It is interesting to read his opinion of his blog. He speaks as if it is *All seeing all knowing, path to Righteousness* in fact, it is no more than the *National Enquirer* of the OC blogsphere with a sadisticly cruel twist.
He is getting exactly what he deserves
Repulsed,
Vern is well aware of EVERYTHING! Him and I have discussed it, he has even told me over the phone that Art and Sean are crazy. Yet in public he simply chooses to look the other way and now even join in the piling on with the insults, personal attacks and stalking.
There are a lot of things Art and Sean have done to me and my family that I did not advertise on this blog or elsewhere that the public does not know about. Why, because unlike them I did not feel the political sphere had any interest in our pissing match. But when I found a legal avenue to at least hold Art accountable for his actions, I took it. It is a matter of holding him responsible for his actions.
Hey Vern! Know what else is a pathetic boring spectacle? A grown man like yourself trying to pass a roadside DUI check and failing. Putting the lives of hard working fathers and mothers and innocent children in harms way because your addiction to alcohol/drugs outways your compassion for decent law abiding Americans. A repeat DUI offender like yourself sitting in a taxpayer funded jail cell eating taxpayer funded bologna sandwiches who still manages to find the huevos to call decent hard working folks ” assclowns” is truely pathetic.
Great job Lib’s, claiming the “high road” while allowing comments like this.
As a progressive, I am ashamed of your thin -skinned approach to the blogosphere. You have givin’ as good as you’ve got, your WHINING smacks of utter HYPOCRISY.
hey cheminowski, i didnt think you could do it but you actually made yourself and this blog look worse than you did a few days ago. you and pedroza both should just get out of the blog biz you really have nothing to bring but shame upon yourselves. and by the way, nice hail mary pass you threw with this posting.
I only post on this case when there’s a significant development or Art misrepresents what’s going on, as he did here:
“At one point during our recent settlement discussions, which as you all know by now went nowhere, I decided to test the Lib OC crew by offering the Orange Juice blog to them on a platter. They offered only $5,000 for this blog, which is laughable. Our true value is incalculable.”
We didn’t offer him anything; We only told him based on available data that the blog had a cash value of $5,000 and NewSantaAna had a cash value of $1,000. We asked him to confirm the accuracy of the cash value of the blogs and he did. We did not offer him anything; he offered it up and threw his blog team under the bus.
****NEWS FLASH!*****
Desperate man takes desperate action!
You are petty and vindictive, this whole mess reflects WORSE on you than it does on Art.
****NEWS FLASH!*****
Desperate man takes desperate action!
You are petty and vindictive, this whole mess reflects WORSE on you than it does on Art.
I disagree. We closed on a bunch of new ads this week with committments for others. We won “Best Political blog” from the OC Press Club. We made a positive impact on how the Santa Ana City Council adheres to the Brown Act because of complaints we filed with the AG’s office, we broke the story on Shawn Nelson accepting a generous county pension that he campaigned against.
As for the lawsuit, my business is named for my children, both underage at the time of the NAMBLA redirects. We asked Art to remove the redirects and he refused even after he was told my business was named for my children. I don’t know if you are a parent, but what exactly would you have done in my situation? I refuse to capitulate to a bully. I defended my business name. I haven’t budged from my original position and all Art has done is retreat.
But then again, if it makes me petty and vindictive in your eyes and you’re hiding behind an anon name, then I don’t have much to worry about do I?
I am not disputing the fact that Art stepped over the line with the whole NAMBLA thing, but you are going to get your “pound of flesh”, what is petty and vindictive is the continual humiliation.
Publishing his negotiations with you is UGLY BEHAVIOR and says more about your character than any “redirect” ever could.
Are you sure your not a right-winger? I mean using the “I had to protect the children defense” is pretty lame, I’m sure little Alexander and Madison would have understood about someone else’s bad behavior, what will really be hard for them is to understand yours.
anon– if you’ll note, Art sent the negotiations over to OC Weekly and they published it. But in typically Art fashion, he left out unflattering details of offers he made to us. If you’re going to disclose negotiations, then disclose all of them. We dropped the other shoe. My son is a college freshman and fully supports my position in the lawsuit. My daughter is 11 and I see no reason to have to explain what NAMBLA is to her. And unlike Art, I don’t hide behind my kids. I protect them.
Might I suggest you read the lawsuit and all the emails from Art included in the initial legal filing. Now imagine he did this to your family. How do you react? My response was to seek the advice of my lawyer and pursue legal action to hold Art accountable. I won’t apologize for that.
So Art is the yardstick you use when judging your behavior?
“Art sent the negotiations over to OC Weekly”
or in other words;
“Art did it first!”
I think the “child” you should be worried about is the one in the mirror.
I think you misunderstand; responding to statements Art makes where key information is left out because it makes him look bad was the goal here. Gustavo really should have gotten our side of the story out with his post in the morning, but since he failed to do so, it was up to us to respond.
Truth is we never made an offer for his blog, we only assigned it a cash value that he confirmed was accurate. He was the one so willing to throw his own bloggers under the bus. Sorry, but I’m not about to let our readers only get his side of the story considering how much stuff he makes up out of whole cloth.
So the deadlines have come and gone.
Are you going to pull the trigger, or what?
Art Pedroza and the sleazy juice blog need to go. There is nothing redeeming about it. The unprovoked attacks, lies, manipulations, intolerance, and hate speech spewed by Pedroza and his blogger thugs is what makes all blogs lose credibility.
Do it. Take him out and kill the juice blog.
we are preparing to file motions for default judgment. It’s pretty cut and dry.
Dan said: “We asked Art to remove the redirects and he refused even after he was told my business was named for my children.”
That sounds familiar Dan – Art’s response to me after I demanded that he delete a disgusting comment with reference to my daughter –
“… you were asking for trouble.â€
Absolutely nothing is out of bounds for this deranged lunatic. I am sorry that I was ever associated with him.
I was friendly with him once too Mike. I’ll point out that none of us have gone after any of his children but he certainly has no problem going after anyone else’s.
BTW, I’m still waiting for his apologists to defend his decision to defy a federal court order. One of my neighbors who is a lawyers suggests a possibility of jail time. Perhaps we should buy the domain name of http://www.orangejumpsuitblog.com?
OMG
Orangejumpsuitblog……I’m still laughing!
Two wrongs or more do not make anything right. Posting up legal and confidental information like this post does not help your image.
It is not that anyone involved in this could or should be considered innocent of any wrong doing, illegal or otherwise.
By you own post a couple of different offers were made and you rejected them, which is your right to do so, but what is the point other than possibly trying to add fire to the flames of this post.
I enjoy reading many things on both your blog here and on the OJ, but my prediction is that both blogs will come to an end if all parties keep this fight going to the end.
Neither blog should allow personal information to be posted about individuals, it is not the publics business and it detracts from the intergety of the blogs. Both the LibOC and OJ have readers that respect and look forward to the information and thought of the writers on each.
Time for everyone to move on, yes there is plently of hurt and personal damage to go around, why continue to add to it?
Jim,
I have known you for quite a few years. The only reason any of the content of this post is up is not because “Art started something.” This information has been posted to respond to the incomplete information that Art put out.
Last year, when Art broke the law, we told him he was doing it, we asked him to stop, we told hime we would take in Irvine whatever legal action necessary to protect our professional and personnal interests from his unlawful actions. He refused to budge, so we had to sue. We are here to day because Art broke the law and he is draging out the process to delay paying the costs of his mistake.
Art and Sean posted financial data on me and others on their blog claiming it was public record, albeit records obtained illegally through Sean H. Mill’s employer, Advantage Title in Irvine.
THe case has never been about free speech, or libel.
Art has made his bed. He’s just now squeeling like a stuck pig because he watching his consequences rapidly come towards him.
Jim —
why not admonish Art for sneding legal and confidential settlement emails to OC Weekly then? Does it help HIS image? I’ve done nothing illegal here Jim. Do your homework. Art’s offers did not come close to paying our legal fees and he is in no position to make demands of us. As far as posting personal information, Art has published divorce papers for Chief Walters, 10-year old bankrupcy filings of Trung Nguyen, and allowed links to be published concerning Claudio Gallegos’ financial affairs. Express your appropriate outrage over on OJ Jim. We’re simply playing the game by the rules and standards they have set. I have no sympathy for Art.
I’ll be happy to move on. Art had his chance to settle. He declined. Now we’re following through on our legal proceedings in federal court where a judge will decide this.
I have said to Art in private that to continue this was not to anyone’s benefit. I in no way condone any actions relating to pointing websites to questionable sites or keeping website names that should belong to those who actually have the name.
I am not aware that any of these actions or posting the e-mails you did here or posting public records of bankruptcy are illegal.
But in a civil court damages may be rewarded.
If a court order was ignored then the court needs to decide on a remedy.
That actions were taken by many in the “blog war” were morally wrong and have cause damages to reputations is not in question. Monetary damages may have also resulted to people involved.
I do not feel sorry for anyone involved.
I have no problem with rejecting offers that you found lacking that is entirely up to you.
I would suggest to all that no future posts go up about this and you have a judge settle it.
My experience with these type of things is the more information that goes out the more documents end up in the court. More documents usually equals more legal costs which are currently coming out of your pocket.
I would hope that most of the readers of both blogs find these posts in either place distasteful and counter productive.
Art looks to be going broke and losing his home. Not your fault, it is the economy. I expect the court will issue some judgment in the matter, usually these do not make either side completely happy and it will take some period of time to collect. The court can look losing parties money situation to determine payments.
So set a date go to court and get it over with, let us all move on to work on more productive issues.
Jim — No one is asking you to feel sorry for anyone. I too wish the case would be resolved and soon. In my favor of course.
Dan…you whine like a little girl like you do to the referees during the IYBL games that you coach. Who cares about your “awards” and imagined accolades? You sold your soul during this whole “war” or whatever and showed that you would stoop to new lows to get what you want. Did Art commit some wrongs? Sure. But to take it to the depths that you have to try to destroy someone is pretty low. I bet you’d do that to your own daughter too if you had the chance. Say she brings home a guy that you don’t care for much, would you try to destroy her and the person that she loves? You are a total embarrasment to liberals, Democrats and progressives and you make me sick. At least Vern Nelson doesn’t sit in his imagined fantasy world like you. At least he has some principles that he actually fights for and does not pay cheap lip service to them. So go celebrate your shallow victory in that fantasyland that you live in known as Northpark.
I’m sorry, I thought I was filing a lawsuit to protect my business name, the blog’s names, and the names of my friends. I’m not trying to destroy anyone (he’s doing a good job of that on his own). My settlement offer all along as been for reimbursement of legal fees and an apology. This isn’t about making money, just recouping what we spent. Art is the reason the amount keeps increasing.
And get the neighborhood right pal; NorthPark is the development next door.
I’ve only had one technical foul in seven years of coaching and that was for calling a extra timeout I thought I had. Hardly whining is it….my daughter’s not playing basketball this year but I am reffing soccer.
LOL I don’t know, this sounds like some fertile territory for journamalism.
“art is the reason the amount keeps increasing” give me an f-ing break! the reason theres an amount at all is because you got a shady lawyer to represent you in this lame lawsuit not pedroza. be thankful he doesnt have a nutsack and you’ll probably get something out of it but if you get nothing you need to do the right thing and pay that lawyer back. and as far as you losing 11 grand a month save it for those who believe pedroza is a pedophile. face it cherminowski you blew it on this one.
Jose — per Sean and Art, I have a “terrorist lawyer.” Get it right. And I have never said Art is a pedophile. I have merely, truthfully stated he willingly redirected URLs to NAMBLA and Gay Porn, wrote a post about the redirects on OJ (without mentioning the redirects) and wrote an email about the redirects (again without mentioning where they were redirected) to get the readers of said blog post and email to actually click through to the sites. That is classic promotion. Aside from a few anon commenters beating me up over this, you have no idea how many people I have met in Santa Ana and OC who have congratulated me for suing Art. I haven’t won anything, but I would say they outnumber the same group of ankle biters criticizing me for the lawsuit.
Art was advised by me not to proceed with URL redirecting. Art was advised by me about limits of free speech usage. Art was advised by me that if ordered to turn over URL’s he would eventually have to and pay legal bills if he let it get that far. I helped break ground on these laws with Pat Buchanan URL’s in 2000.
He wanted to get money out of the liboc group. That’s it. That’s why he did it. Art is a liar and a con. His progressivism is false. Sean Mill broke the only agreement he ever made with me and hasn’t kept one with anyone else as far as I know. The Orange Juice started as a wide open forum for all voices and has turned into a weapon used to attack others.
Looking forward to the OJ Blog dying and seeing orangejuiceblog.com under the Minute Maid site. If you acquire it, don’t resurrect.
Now THERE’S a bitter guy. Ever since we discontinued his incomprehensible hate-filled screeds from Denver.
Vern — be honest. He was kicked off the blog for outing Art as “Zorro.” And he follows a long line of other former OJ bloggers who will confirm everything Terry said here.
The silly Zorro thing was a pretext (that’s right Terry.) I was sick of his constant dishonesty and racism, and was looking for a chance to get his poison off the blog. I don’t believe it will be “blogwhoring” to share his final spasm on the OJ:
http://www.orangejuiceblog.com/2010/05/yes-we-can-immigration-open-thread/
To be clear, he tried to post this anonymously as “La Raza Blanca” – the White Race – and I wouldn’t let him. It was basically a video that was real popular that week with Mexican haters, of some over-the-top Chicano professor spouting off at UCLA. Then he got on the comment section under his real name with some more anti-Mexican bullshit. This led to fights that escalated to his removal. And the people rejoiced.
Oh Vern, I’ll let the blogwhoring thing by this time, because it points out your own hypocrisy. Terry posts anonymously and then under his own name which led to his removal, while you — as editor — allow Art to post as Zorro sometimes commenting about his posts in the third person. Vern — I know for a fact people try to post comments blasting Art that never see the light of day on your blog. In my book, it makes you both hypocritical and dishonest.
And Mexican bashing aside, Terry’s statement in regards to the lawsuit in how he advised Art happened long before his removal from OJ. His statements are as damaging to Art in court as Art’s defiance of a federal court order to turn over discovery documents and pay sanctions.
You are dense, brother. On purpose or not, who can say. He posted anti-Mexican BS under “La Raza Blanca.” And this after months of bashing ACORN as “prosititute peddlers” and all kinds of other poisonous lies. I was glad to have a pretext to let him go. But go ahead, depose David Duke.
“Poisonous lies” Well, your blog would know all about that Vern. Why not start approving some of those negative comments directed at Art I know my friends post. I keep telling them not to bother when the email me “the comment never made it.”
Just what sort of dirt do Art and Sean have on you Vern that makes you so afraid to cross them? Your defense chips away at your integrity with every comment.
I don’t delete any critical comments and I don’t approve of doing that. It may come as a baffling surprise that I don’t 100% run the blog. But this little mini-thread is about Terry Crowley, not Art and Sean.
at least have the intellectual honesty to tell readers negative comments are deleted on the OJ even if you don’t do it. And actuall, this mini thread is about Art and Sean as well as Terry. You tolerated his rants until he turned on Art and outed him as Zorro. Can’t have that…can’t let the Ministry of Truth be compromised. Now I just feel sorry for you Vern. You’re the editor of this blog in name only with no authority and no say so.
Truth be told, I’d been wanting to get rid of Crowley and replace him with a more honest rightwinger for a long time, but he was our WEBMASTER. By May 10 we were able to have another webmaster lined up. So try to spin that nasty, whatever.
Vern – so your blog tolerated a dishonest and possibly racist webmaster? I’m shocked, shocked that the ministry of truth would put up with this. Stop digging Vern; every response makes you more of a hypocrite on a blog full of them
You can have the last word as each of your last words get lamer and lamer. Okay I just screwed that up didn’t I? Here:
Dan Chmielewski says: I’m glad you admitted that not everything at the Orange Juice has always been exactly perfect Vern, this just shows what a hypocrite you are and how can you dare show your face in public? Bwa ha ha. I’ll show YOU guys!
Did you go to Servite Dan? Your arguing style is as lame and formulaic as your BFF Matt Cunningham.
Terry — Thanks. If required, we may ask you for a deposition if that’s OK with you.
Vern,
Posting that particular video under “La Raza Blanca†does seem like a provocative thing to do. Heavens, we wouldn’t want the OJ blog to do anything controversial or provocative.
I know that you were very proud of getting Terry kicked off of the OJ blog – not a very “free speech friendly” type of thing for you to do Vern.
Lam Pho pretty much said it all –
“Art, you’re not the same man you were a year ago. When I first got on here, you more or less taught me to not take this board too seriously. Hell, you were proud to be the King of spin, saying you’re too good at it. … Now you just post nonsense using multiple aliases and deleting posts that challenge your reasoning and integrity. You just don’t have it anymore, your posts come across mean and ignorant.â€
Oh come on Junior. Terry was not a good representation of you right-wingers. He is extravagantly dishonest and mean. You could have done a better job yourself.
Poor Vern can’t even make himself liked in the progressive blogosphere. and he runs the editor job on charity, not merit. Since I can’t say that nutter group without throwing up in my mouth, understand where this man with the 120 proof disease stands morally. Keep between the lines when you write Vern. The hard stuff just makes you like Art, a whiny victim that hates the America that created the prosperity he enjoys.
Art just called to change the record on the phone call. Since I was not deeply involved, background would have to be done to verify. He says he didnt call me for a couple weeks after he bought the URLs. If that makes a difference, a simple check of my phone record and the date the URLs were bought would clear it up.
He bought them around November 13 Terry….
I will get back to you on that Dan.
What “progressive blogosphere,” Terry? Are you talking about this place?
By the way, where does Vern stand on the record for redirecting URLs to NAMBLA porn? Ask him if he voiced that concern to Art. I certainly wasn’t in on the weekly “cram” sessions. Another leg gone on Verns footstool of moral clarity I’m guessing. If not, Dan, another deposition.
Think Vern notices amidst his libelous (slander is spoken Vern) screed, I was giving Art advice?? Good advice??
Oh, did I libel you Terry? You ridiculous ding-dong, say where.
My position on the NAMBLA redirect? Bad idea. DUH.
Vern —
Art has a comment on his blog that I suspect Mayor Pro Tem Claudia Alvarez was in on the conspiracy. Actually, she’s never been named in any of the lawsuit filings. So is Art telling me he’s conspired with Claudia? Did he get free legal advice from her? Do tell.
Yeah Dan, Claudia is coming after you, fingernails sharpened, hair mussed, eyes bloodshot and fangs bared. Claudia is coming up your stairs. Claudia is banging down your door. Quick, get your crucifixes out, your garlic!
Much as I find the writings of Crowley, and much of Dan’s actions, reprehensible, an important difference can be discerned between me and them.
In short: They dream of destroying the Orange Juice, whereas I can’t picture myself wanting to destroy the Liberal OC or Terry’s stoopid “Libertarian” Examiner.
Difference between good and evil perhaps?
Exactly Vern. Much of the evil in the world has been perpetrated by those who first claim to be a victim. Or, in your case, “they started it!” by the way, big difference between holding an opinion and actually DOING something about it Vern. Did you let Art know your opinion. Do tell if you have a moral backbone weasel.
Vern — I have no intention of destroying the Orange Juice blog, preventing Art from using his First Amendment rights to defame people and embarrass himself. I simply want a judgment in my favor for his illegal and offensive acts and to collect my legal fees. I also want a sincere apology from him. But since it doesn’t look like a settlement is going to happen, we’ll see this through. I have never wavered in my demand for settlement. The terms have always been the same. Then again, Art did defy a federal court order and no judge will look favorably on that.
Good and evil? Really? Honestly Vern, when Art told *everybody* you were in jail, no one here posted a thing about it. Do you think the OJ blog would extend any of us that same courtesy if one of us were doing jail time for anything?
The only reason I won’t call you evil is because I don’t think you hurt anyone when you got pulled over … but you sure could have.
What a SLIME BALL you are, Chimielewski! You need to take a good look at what YOU ARE DOING in the name of “protecting” yourself.
You HAVE BECOME the “evil” you abhor.
I would rather my children see the NAMBLA site any day, then EVER see me PURPOSELY DISCLOSE HURTFUL PERSONAL INFORMATION about another human being for the sole purpose of justifying my own rotten behavior.
YOU CAN’T BLAME THIS ON ART!
Art’s blog has revealed personal financial information of Claudio Gallegos, Chris Prevatt, and the divorce records of Santa Ana police chief Paul Walters long before we posted any of Art’s personal financial records. And I never posted any of that; that was Claudio’s post and his decision to do so (and eye for an eye).
If you would expose your children to NAMBLA every day, I am going to suggest you’re an unfit parent. You’re certainly entitled to call me a slimeball; and I’m entitled to call you a coward for doing so behind a phoney web name. Nice courage. Or should I say, lack of any….
So how does ANY of that JUSTIFY YOUR dragging out Vern’s personal information?
WHO CAN YOU BLAME? Did Vern do it to you first?
Then you must retaliate, and if Vern was merely voicing a difference of opinion, then quick, invoke Art and all the bad things he’s done and hope like hell no one notices what a complete a**hole you’ve become.
Hey douchebag Anon-person; Vern himself outed his DUI arrest and jail time on the O-Joke. Art’s a perv, Sean’s a bully-bigot, and Vern’s a drunk. Would you let Art babysit your kids? Would you let Sean into your home? Would you let Vern drive them home? Maybe Vern could write a little song about driving drunk so Republicans he hates will be transfixed by his wit in song. Andy Quatch sings back up but has a better lawyer than Vern.
Actually Andy should sing lead, since he had three times the blood alcohol level I did. But he probably has to check with his lawyer first. Isn’t that Van Tran?
I know, I know, MY BAD. I don’t drive now and I usually don’t drink. I have too much fun fighting numbskulls like you.
And anon, you’re exactly right. Even though I’ve got a very thick skin regarding anything anyone can say about me, This exchange between you and Dan really demonstrates the meaning of “dishonest weasel.” And that’s not you!
cheminowski, you are not entitled to pedrozas hard drive and because he didnt hand it over to you isnt going to piss the judge off. it’s crazy for you to even think you’re entitled to it. i mean the nerve you have even thinking you are in some way entitled to go into his life that way just blows my mind. say what you want about him but it says quite a lot about you.
jose s.
What part of a federal judge ordering Pedroza to comply with all requsts for discovery that we had made and sanctioning him with $2,500 in legal fees for making us get the order do you think won’t piss off the judge? What part of that judicial order makes you believe we were not entitled to a copy of his hard drive, which was part of that discovery request?
Discovery, what you seem to believe is an invasion of Pedroza’s life, is simply a matter of legal process. It is a process that allows a plaintiff who has a valid claim to ascertain what additional evidence to support their claim exists, or identify other co-defendants.
a judge is making you pay 2500? or do you mean your attorney? another thing prevatt, cheminowski can answer for himself he doesnt need your help to look like a bigger fool. and what happened to the tan nguyen coverage? did you know there was a hung jury on his trial? our friend the bolsavik never mentions tan but this blog and the oj do and if you noticed not a word from either of you. why? because of this stupid court case.
No Moron, The judge is making Pedroza pay $2,500. And since I am a party to the lawsuit, I am simply correcting your ignorance.
As far as covering the Tan Nguyen story, from what I understand a mistrial has not yet been declared. Once the jury makes it’s determination, I am sure we will write about it.
Furthermore, this story is not the only thing we have written about over the past several days. It may be the only one you have read, but it is not the only one written.
wow resorting to name calling eh prevatt? moron no less and ignorant to boot! ok i’m still a little “ignorant” here because i still dont understand. you say the judge is charging pedroza 2500 that will go to who the attorney or the courts or to you and cheminowski? because he didnt turn over his hard drive full of kiddie porn i’m sure according to you guys. really prevatt, i think this thing is wearing on you guys. i think you guys are really starting to feel the heat of your bad decision. i know you’re pot commited and theres no turning back but remember: you guys made this decision and it was a bad one. and as far as tan nguyen goes he will always be tied into this blog for the threats he made against mike lawson. have the decency to stay on top of his trial.
The sanction of $2,500 is paid to the plaintiffs to cover legal fees related to having to file the request with the court to compel Pedroza to comply with discovery. What part of that don’t you understand?
The materials requested in discovery included a copy of Art Pedroza’s hard drive, that one item was not however all that was requested, Art failed to respond to any of the request and the order was to compel him to do so.
I am well aware of the history between this blog and Tan Nguyen. The vandalism of Tan Nguyen’s signs helped inspire and launch this blog. I am keeping up on this trial and I have written about it several times. When the jury actually decides the case I’m sure I will write about it again.
“moron” here, so what you are really saying is that the 2500 is to pay for your lawyer expenses because your lawyer had to go in there and ask for his hard drive for discovery right? you guys wanted his hard drive and you sent your lawyer to go and get it at your expense right? am i getting that right? see i know about discovery having to serve joseph fletcher with discovery papers and he of course didnt comply either. sometimes people just dont want to play by the rules thats how court goes sometimes. in my case i was dealing with somebody far more powerfull than you and your lawyer somebody who knew the rules but as i said some people just dont comply. just because you want something and you think you are entitled doesnt mean your going to get it. and a persons hard drive is something pretty private. i think it’s pretty “moronic” for you guys to think you should get that hard drive. and if you sent your lawyer to court one extra time or to write it up you need to pay for it. court is expensive. lawyers are expensive but remember it was you two who chose to take this road. now dont start bitching if your left holding the bill.
one more thing, the vandalism that helped launch and inspire this blog as you said was done by me. at least the bulk of it was and i’m not the least bit ashamed to say that. if mike lawson would have been dragged to court in any way i would have come forward in a second. you can say this blog means a lot to me and to see what you guys have done and are doing now is just shameful. you shame this blog that i helped to “inspire” as you said.
For the record, Mike does not agree with your assessment of the merits of our lawsuit againt Art Pedroza and the OrangeJuiceBlog, or of the status of this blog.
jose s.;
We served Art with discovery requests, he responded to none of them. He was legally required to respond with a legal justification as to why he should not turn over the information we requested, or turn over the information. He did not do either and told us to get an order to compel. We received that order and since Art had provided no justification for his failure to act, the judge ordered him to pay the legal costs related to deeking that order. We did not just “send our attorney to get an order for Art’s hard drive” as you state. We sent our attorney to get an order to compel Art to comply with all of our discovery requests, of which a copy of his hard drive was one of the components.